Curse

Jul 11, 2005, 08:35 PM // 20:35

Energy Burn and especially Energy Surge are incredibly sub-par skills. Chaos storm is godly in efficiency, and Cry of Frustration as we were testing the other day has a ~20 foot interrupt radius-at least. In other words, it's half the range of a Ward radius.

Nexx · Jul 12, 2005, 05:56 PM // 17:56

Quote:

Originally Posted by Enigmatics

Right, does savage slash work while you have illusionary weapon up? My illusionary weaponist also has phantom pain+shatter illusions for the deep wound.

Savage slash no longer works if you have illusionary weapon on.

Epinephrine · Jul 12, 2005, 06:52 PM // 18:52

I agree that Cry of Frustration can be fun in PvE - it works pretty well vs predictable groups that all start casting a long skill/spell at once (Apply Poison on spiders/undead archers; meteor/fireball on hydras and other creatures that feel they simply must all cast a big spell at the same time).

Lord Tekster · Jul 12, 2005, 08:21 PM // 20:21

a skill such as migraine helps increase the effectiveness of cry of frustration

Third Quarter · Jul 12, 2005, 09:14 PM // 21:14

I love the fact that Cry of Frustration's effect is so easy to recognize: everybody knows who got got schooled and how when they see that "!@#$" word bubble.

QuixotesGhost · Jul 13, 2005, 10:41 PM // 22:41

Quote:

Originally Posted by rubics

I've been fiddling with a me/n build and would like some insight into complimentary skills/spells.

The basis of this build is virulence. I just really like that necromancer spell. I am also using plague sending. Next I through in Illusion of Haste w/o any attributes invested in Illusion. Basically I cast Illusion, then send the crippled effect over when it kicks in, and then finish it off with virulence.

The idea between these three is that I'm getting a bit tired of being ganged up on by warriors. This set up lets me run away when I'm getting ganged up on so that I can attack from a distance again. I also like the idea of being able to criple, weaken, and disease someone for 25 pts.

My question is if anyone has any ideas about how to flesh out the other 5 slots. I'm intersted in using ether feast because I feel like I need a little bit of healing ability for staying power. That means investing a bit in inspiration. What would you spend on the other 4 spots?

Thanks.

I'm running a Me/N and personally I find one the easiest, no-frills way to handle warriors is Midnight Signet + Plague Touch. Very low cast time and energy costs, allows me to go, blind for you and blind for you super quick then get back to the job of disrupting casters. If they were smart enough to bring a condition remove, then it's midnight sig, diversion (you almost always tag mend ailment or whatever they're using) plauge touch. If you want to go plauge sending it'd be even better (the energy cost, cast time, and life lost is a little off putting for me) becuase you could reach out and hit all those pesky rangers.

The only problem being of course is that fact that midnight signet is elite and therefore you can't bring virulence along with it.

Third Quarter · Jul 14, 2005, 04:59 PM // 16:59

I don't like Signet of Midnight. It's a handy skill with zero energy cost and a fast recharge, but it's elite, is a touch skill, and generally isn't remotely as good as the Ranger's Throw Dirt.

It's a good skill, but as an elite, I find it hard to justify using it instead of something like Energy Drain.

On the other hand, if you can find a warrior to blind, cast Spirit of Failure on them, and you have infinite energy. (seriously, I tested this, and I was literally getting more than I was able to spend)

QuixotesGhost · Jul 14, 2005, 07:14 PM // 19:14

Quote:

Originally Posted by Third Quarter

I don't like Signet of Midnight. It's a handy skill with zero energy cost and a fast recharge, but it's elite, is a touch skill, and generally isn't remotely as good as the Ranger's Throw Dirt.

It's a good skill, but as an elite, I find it hard to justify using it instead of something like Energy Drain.

On the other hand, if you can find a warrior to blind, cast Spirit of Failure on them, and you have infinite energy. (seriously, I tested this, and I was literally getting more than I was able to spend)

Personally I like it better than Throw Dirt due to the fact that it's a 15 second blind with a 15 second recharge, toss plague touch along with it and I can keep two guys blinded for the majority of the match with minimal effort and energy involved. I mean there have been times where I have had blind on two warriors/rangers, backfire on the monk, while I'm guilting and powerleaking the offensive caster. Then switch back to the monk for some diversions then run around and blind everyone all over again.

Ibanezgtrsst07 · Jul 16, 2005, 02:39 PM // 14:39

Here's my Mesmer build.

Aeris Is Spiked

Fast Casting: 12+1
Domination: 10+4
Inspiration: 8+1

1. Energy Burn
2. Wastrels Worry
3. Energy Tap
4. Energy Drain (E)
5. Arcane Echo
6. Mind Wrack
7. Shatter Enchantment
8. Diversion

If you add up all of the energy that CAN be lost, you steal 42 energy and they lose 10 energy, adding up to a 52 energy lost in a matter of 3 seconds.

Order:
Shatter Enchantment (If enchantment is present)
Arcane Echo
Energy Drain
Mind Wrack
Energy Drain
Energy Burn
Energy Tap
Wastraels Worry
Diversion
Wastraels Worry

With this build, I was able to take out spellcasters in a matter of seconds. There is never a fear of energy management, it works like a charm. I strongly reccomend this build.

Precision · Jul 17, 2005, 10:34 PM // 22:34

Hi guys, need an opinion on this build for PvP..

1) Backfire
2) Power Leak
3) Power Spike
4) Cry of Frustration
5) Shame
6) Energy Tap
7) Channeling
8) Hex Breaker

I am looking to block spells here, if you didn't guess. Suggestions appreciated.

Zeru · Jul 18, 2005, 04:13 AM // 04:13

WW blows utterly, it's just a crappy dot unless you're using some wierd setup with soul barbs where it MIGHT be useful in a team build.

MW isn't as bad but it still sucks because of the trigger condition that must be met and is something you can't determine. Throwing MWs randomly won't accomplish anything, and neither does consistently keeping someone at 0 energy unless it's a war or ranger with spirit shackles (wrong target anyway).

If you are looking for a shutdown/interruption build I heavily reccomend power block, if only for key time uses on certain characters. Diversion also rocks and you should probably take power drain over channeling to keep your energy healthy while staying further away.

Ibanezgtrsst07 · Jul 18, 2005, 06:36 AM // 06:36

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zeru

WW blows utterly, it's just a crappy dot unless you're using some wierd setup with soul barbs where it MIGHT be useful in a team build.

MW isn't as bad but it still sucks because of the trigger condition that must be met and is something you can't determine. Throwing MWs randomly won't accomplish anything, and neither does consistently keeping someone at 0 energy unless it's a war or ranger with spirit shackles (wrong target anyway).

If you are looking for a shutdown/interruption build I heavily reccomend power block, if only for key time uses on certain characters. Diversion also rocks and you should probably take power drain over channeling to keep your energy healthy while staying further away.

On the contrary, MW is an excellent skill. First off it is a hex skill. So, you can smack a hex such as diversion, and spam this spell due to it's low energy and instant recharge. So, when a monk goes to cast Remove Hex, it only removes the WW and not the other skill. Otherwise they take the damage, and they get smacked with another one right after.

Mind Wrack is an excellent skill when combined with Energy Drain, Arcane Echo, Energy Burn, and Energy Tap. It is a successful way to take down Warriors and Rangers once the Monks are down. And it works great against monks provided they don't have Spell Breaker.

Power Block is a great skill, but the recharge time is way too high. It's either hit or miss, and if you miss, there goes your elite for a long time.

Zeru · Jul 18, 2005, 08:05 AM // 08:05

Er no they both suck. I'm really sure you need another way to take down monk-less wars/rangers...puh lease

.

There is one 'effective' way of mind wrack usage. spirit shackles. However, the only two classes who will be affected by this are warriors and rangers and even then you have to count on a remove hex not being used in time. However, again, you are using it for classes you target last and which have lowest priority.

For deeper reasons why mind wrack sucks (not mentioning the fact that mesmer energy denial is subpar compared to ranger and even warrior in certain scenarios), you have to look at what the trigger condition is and what you are doing to achieve it.

For 20 seconds, if target foe's Energy is zero, that foe takes 40-75 damage and Mind Wrack ends. 5/1/5

First off, how do you know when your target will reach zero? To put it simply, you won't. You can't determine their max energy easy and you can't tell what energy management options they are using without close scrutiny. You can guess when they are low if they are using signet of devotion (if they have it). However low energy isn't the only reason for using a sig devo. Frankly to determine a foes energy and how close he is to reaching 0 is especially difficult to do in battle, even moreso because a mesmer is supposed to be on two casters.

Mesmers are not run to just beat the crap out of one monk. They are supposed to cripple two casters, not beat down a useless person over and over. Mind wrack is set to do the second. In order for it to work effectively, you have to be constantly keeping their energy at 0. What can a monk at 0 energy do exactly? Blessed Sig and Sig of Devotion would be the best bets, and frankly if a monk has to use these only he's already out. Again, you're just beating up on one monk over and over who is already down and not holding your own weight (keeping this on two people with energy regen capabilities like OOB is extremely difficult if not impractical). In order for the condition to be reached efficiently you have to force them to reach it and that forcing is going to waste a lot of resources.

Now you have to look at what you are doing with all your attention focused on forcing the enemy to 0. 87~ damage every 5 seconds. That's 17.4 dps. Hardly good. Yeah, 87 damage for 5 energy isn't bad (though a warrior will outdamage it with no energy spent and a ranger for extremely little), but when you look at all you have to do to make it happen, it's a LOT more than just 5 energy.

For wastrels worry, it's a crappy cover hex unless you're using it after backfire since otherwise they cast through it and even then the cover window is small indeed, forcing you to keep spamming it and hoping they don't use convert hexes to get rid of your very important hex that you are spending all your time worrying about (again, beating up on only one guy is not a mesmers job). And then again, why bother with a cover hex? Remove hex is a 2 second cast and is very easy to spot and interrupt (the other single hex removals have horrendous recharges). As a mes, you don't want to be reacting to the enemy in most cases, you want to be controlling them and it's much better to be proactive in a spot like this.

Enigmatics · Jul 18, 2005, 11:44 AM // 11:44

WW is pretty sought after in Soul Barbs builds.

rii · Jul 20, 2005, 04:28 PM // 16:28

Talking about 'waiting for recharge' is moot point considering both skills have a recharge of 5 seconds, and youll be spamming mw anyways...

ww/shatter delusions is a fair 134 damage spike, for 10 energy with 10 second cooldown.

soul barbs builds arent actually very good. I tried it, with ww, and the dps was mild.... its gimmicky, like fragility (except frag rocks.. i got mark of rodgort today

)

and whether mw is a good spell on its own.... it lasts 20 seconds unlinked and so makes a good cover hex at a push. Its almost always on my me skillbar just for that.

SiDima · Jul 20, 2005, 08:43 PM // 20:43

Here si my current me/e build:

12 air
10 fc +3 rune, +1 mask
8 inspir +2 rune

Elemental attunment
Air attunment
Channeling
Lightning strike
Lightning Javelin
Chain lightning
lightning orb
enerevating charge

+15 armour when casting armour set

the build has about 10 sec of downtime but because of your ablility to spam spells fast, that wont matter, you wont run out of energy while you are enchanted with attunments and channelling, in a 4vs4 match your energy shouldnt move up or down but in a 8vs8 battle you should always be near the top

Enigmatics · Jul 20, 2005, 08:49 PM // 20:49

Why channeling? Air spells are best used at a distance, and channeling won't help that. You might want to replace it with drain enchantment, power drain, energy tap or leech signet.

Dahl · Jul 20, 2005, 09:11 PM // 21:11

Are mesmer primaries only crappy in the beginning or do they stay that way? I've never had so much trouble in pre searing with any character. I have no means of protecting myself or healing myself so i just die so fast. 2 monsters on me at once? It's all over then, no way to win, this is retarded.

Is this normal?

Enigmatics · Jul 20, 2005, 10:10 PM // 22:10

Being a mesmer, you won't have any useful aoe spells that aren't elite, and direct damage can be tiring to do in pve, so mesmers are unpopular against mass mobs. However, they happen to be very good pvpers.

Epinephrine · Jul 21, 2005, 02:10 PM // 14:10

Yes, mesmers are weak in the beginning, and the spells you get are the worst of the bunch really, with Conjure Phantasm set to play a starring role - until it turns out to be lousy later on. As you get farther into the game you will find a mesmer more useful - a pair of Hydras was a nasty opponent with my first character, especially as Lina wasn't around in the desert back then - I remember them swooping in and tearing me a new one, demolishing my henchies unless I played it right. The mesmer excels vs that kind of large single/double foe, shutting down the big damage hits, draining energy and rendering them useless. That annoying Monk boss that seemed to take forever to kill, healing as fast as your group could damage it? History. Mesmer will turn it into a cakewalk. Killing Glint with henchmen? Tough for many, but a mesmer can stomp Glint down pretty effectively.

My mesmer/El has NO elementalist attribute point and no skills from El either - needless to say, I'm debating switching secondaries, (though I have ascended already) just that I can't think of anything I'd actually use in place of my Mesmer skills

My only thought is to take ranger to get Serpent's Quickness or Oath Shot (yes, I know it fails 50% with no expertise, it still offers a 50% chance to recharge all my interrupts and energy drains - probably not worth it, but I can dream), or to run Quickening Zephyr - anything that isn't boosting the effectiveness of my mesmer skills is a waste of time. Serpent's quickness I could keep up over half the time with only 6 in WS, resulting in boosting my other skills by about 27.5% effectively - that's not a full extra interrupt or a full extra drain, but it would add up I suspect, letting you hit with the second Power Block 7 seconds sooner, and netting you more energy drains.